Discussion:
Adobe oddity?
(too old to reply)
gareth evans
2020-12-28 16:19:21 UTC
Permalink
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.

Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.

Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.

This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.

Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
JimP
2020-12-28 16:42:40 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 16:19:21 +0000, gareth evans
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Heinlein said it best, 'Never underestimate the power of human
stupidity'.

If they are actually concerned about Adobe flash, they could fix it.
This appears more of of a 'gotcha' than anything else.
--
Jim
Dan Espen
2020-12-28 17:50:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by JimP
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 16:19:21 +0000, gareth evans
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Heinlein said it best, 'Never underestimate the power of human
stupidity'.
If they are actually concerned about Adobe flash, they could fix it.
This appears more of of a 'gotcha' than anything else.
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.

Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
--
Dan Espen
Peter Flass
2020-12-28 18:16:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Espen
Post by JimP
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 16:19:21 +0000, gareth evans
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Heinlein said it best, 'Never underestimate the power of human
stupidity'.
If they are actually concerned about Adobe flash, they could fix it.
This appears more of of a 'gotcha' than anything else.
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
Never liked Flash anyway. A number of platforms I use either didn’t have
Flash or had a lagging version. Usually it did things I didn’t want or
need, and it seemed like sites were forcing you into Flash without
providing an alternative. I’m more than happy to see it go, especially in
favor of a standard product.
--
Pete
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
2020-12-28 18:43:46 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 11:16:15 -0700
Post by Peter Flass
Never liked Flash anyway. A number of platforms I use either didn’t have
Flash or had a lagging version. Usually it did things I didn’t want or
need, and it seemed like sites were forcing you into Flash without
providing an alternative. I’m more than happy to see it go, especially in
favor of a standard product.
Quite so.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
Chris
2020-12-28 19:34:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ahem A Rivet's Shot
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 11:16:15 -0700
Post by Peter Flass
Never liked Flash anyway. A number of platforms I use either didn’t have
Flash or had a lagging version. Usually it did things I didn’t want or
need, and it seemed like sites were forcing you into Flash without
providing an alternative. I’m more than happy to see it go, especially in
favor of a standard product.
Quite so.
I complained to the BBC several years ago about their use of flash for
their videos, but was ignored at the time. Still the same problem, but
looks like they will be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st
century, at last, and will have no cholce but to go html5. Good job
Adobe.

Flash has been a major security risk for years and would never install
it on any system here...

Chris
Carlos E.R.
2020-12-28 22:48:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Ahem A Rivet's Shot
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 11:16:15 -0700
Post by Peter Flass
Never liked Flash anyway. A number of platforms I use either didn’t have
Flash or had a lagging version. Usually it did things I didn’t want or
need, and it seemed like sites were forcing you into Flash without
providing an alternative. I’m more than happy to see it go, especially in
favor of a standard product.
    Quite so.
I complained to the BBC several years ago about their use of flash for
their videos, but was ignored at the time. Still the same problem, but
looks like they will be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st
century, at last, and will have no cholce but to go html5. Good job
Adobe.
Adobe has been forced to remove it, some say. A letter by Steve Jobs
saying that Apple products would not support Flash (dead link:
<https://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughts-on-flash/>). Then on 2015 Chrome
blocked flash videos, and Firefox did something.
Post by Chris
Flash has been a major security risk for years and would never install
it on any system here...
My bank used it.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Andreas Kohlbach
2020-12-29 07:44:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
I complained to the BBC several years ago about their use of flash for
their videos, but was ignored at the time. Still the same problem, but
looks like they will be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st
century, at last, and will have no cholce but to go html5. Good job
Adobe.
No company cares to change their technology, until they are forced to.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/announcements/adobe-flash-end-of-support

Similar to vehicles with Diesel engines. Especially after in European
cities (and China since decades) the air became unbreatable, a law was
passed to exclude these from entering the cities. That was further fueled
by the Volkswagen emissions scandal
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_emissions_scandal>. Since that
car manufacturers (except for trucks) stopped offering cars with Diesel
engines.

People in North America might not have experienced the air pollution by
Diesel cars, as there were only a few manufacturers (or was it even only
Volkswagen?) offering Diesel vehicles. Still it was a big issue in
Europe, prompting manufacturers to only offer gasoline engines, with some
even abandon these in favor of only offering electric vehicles, like
Volvo:

| In July 2017, Volvo announced that new models launched from 2019 onward
| would be fully electric or hybrid-electric, heralding the end of
| production of nearly a century of Volvo vehicles powered solely by the
| internal combustion engine.

Source Wikipedia.
--
Andreas

PGP fingerprint 952B0A9F12C2FD6C9F7E68DAA9C2EA89D1A370E0
Bob Eager
2020-12-29 13:04:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andreas Kohlbach
Similar to vehicles with Diesel engines. Especially after in European
cities (and China since decades) the air became unbreatable, a law was
passed to exclude these from entering the cities.
Not true in the UK. Although there is one tiny area (not in the centre)
which limits petrol and diesel vehicles at certain hours.

All diesel cars can enter, but there is a £12.50 daily charge if they
aren't Euro 6. Proportionate charges for larger vehicles.
--
Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org
gareth evans
2020-12-28 19:37:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Espen
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Even so, no reason to kill it and thereby destroy
historical sites.
J. Clarke
2020-12-28 20:00:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Espen
Post by JimP
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 16:19:21 +0000, gareth evans
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Heinlein said it best, 'Never underestimate the power of human
stupidity'.
If they are actually concerned about Adobe flash, they could fix it.
This appears more of of a 'gotcha' than anything else.
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
It's not like this is news to anybody. Adobe announced EOL for Flash
in July 2017 and they've been advertising the fact all over the place.
It isn't just Adobe involved in this--the major browser developers are
removing Flash support as well.

In any case there is an open source project, "ruffle", that is
supposed to be able to replace Flash Player transparently--whether and
how well it works I have no idea.

<https://ruffle.rs/>
Peter Flass
2020-12-28 22:53:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dan Espen
Post by JimP
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 16:19:21 +0000, gareth evans
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Heinlein said it best, 'Never underestimate the power of human
stupidity'.
If they are actually concerned about Adobe flash, they could fix it.
This appears more of of a 'gotcha' than anything else.
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
It's not like this is news to anybody. Adobe announced EOL for Flash
in July 2017 and they've been advertising the fact all over the place.
It isn't just Adobe involved in this--the major browser developers are
removing Flash support as well.
In any case there is an open source project, "ruffle", that is
supposed to be able to replace Flash Player transparently--whether and
how well it works I have no idea.
<https://ruffle.rs/>
.rs TLD is Serbia. Hate to be prejudiced, but do you trust software from
Serbia?
--
Pete
J. Clarke
2020-12-29 00:00:06 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 15:53:03 -0700, Peter Flass
Post by Peter Flass
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dan Espen
Post by JimP
On Mon, 28 Dec 2020 16:19:21 +0000, gareth evans
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Heinlein said it best, 'Never underestimate the power of human
stupidity'.
If they are actually concerned about Adobe flash, they could fix it.
This appears more of of a 'gotcha' than anything else.
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
It's not like this is news to anybody. Adobe announced EOL for Flash
in July 2017 and they've been advertising the fact all over the place.
It isn't just Adobe involved in this--the major browser developers are
removing Flash support as well.
In any case there is an open source project, "ruffle", that is
supposed to be able to replace Flash Player transparently--whether and
how well it works I have no idea.
<https://ruffle.rs/>
.rs TLD is Serbia. Hate to be prejudiced, but do you trust software from
Serbia?
It's open source. Whether anybody has actually ground through the
code for backdoors and whatnot I have no idea.
Jorgen Grahn
2020-12-29 09:40:33 UTC
Permalink
...
Post by Peter Flass
Post by J. Clarke
In any case there is an open source project, "ruffle", that is
supposed to be able to replace Flash Player transparently--whether and
how well it works I have no idea.
<https://ruffle.rs/>
.rs TLD is Serbia. Hate to be prejudiced, but do you trust software from
Serbia?
It /does/ sound a bit shady, but chances are a programmer from Serbia
has more in common with a US programmer than with his own government.

/Jorgen
--
// Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Oo o. . .
\X/ snipabacken.se> O o .
Bud Spencer
2020-12-29 13:01:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jorgen Grahn
Post by Peter Flass
.rs TLD is Serbia. Hate to be prejudiced, but do you trust software from
Serbia?
It /does/ sound a bit shady, but chances are a programmer from Serbia
has more in common with a US programmer than with his own government.
Seems that crÚme de la crÚme of mental midgets are gathering ... Salty and
sour whiners unite!

Or are your liberal-soy-lard-arses so butthurt that Serbs were one of the
original ANTIFA ... you know, before it was mandatory to suck soros' scaly
pecker and BOATILAS ...

What ever it is, keep up the good work!
--
B⃚̵̶̷̢̺̠̟̜̐͆̀̈́U⃚̶̷̞̝͍͓̔́̔̈́̈́͋D⃚̶̷̞̫̟̔̀̀̔͛͛
Vir Campestris
2020-12-28 21:43:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Espen
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
My guess would be that they _can_ fix it, but it won't make them enough
money to be worth doing.

Andy
John Levine
2020-12-28 22:18:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Vir Campestris
Post by Dan Espen
I'm not sure they think they can fix it.
I believe Flash has been a security risk more than once.
I'm pretty sure HTML5 is an adequate replacement.
Adobe can still market authoring tools which is where they make
their money.
My guess would be that they _can_ fix it, but it won't make them enough
money to be worth doing.
I doubt that a secured version of Flash would be similar enough to the
current swiss cheese version that it would run existing Flash code or
otherwise be of interest to anyone.

Web sites that use Flash have had many years to switch to something
else like HTML5. If they don't find it worth the effort, so be it.
--
Regards,
John Levine, ***@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
danny burstein
2020-12-28 22:30:05 UTC
Permalink
In <rsdlki$1qvn$***@gal.iecc.com> John Levine <***@taugh.com> writes:

[snip]
Post by John Levine
I doubt that a secured version of Flash would be similar enough to the
current swiss cheese version that it would run existing Flash code or
otherwise be of interest to anyone.
Web sites that use Flash have had many years to switch to something
else like HTML5. If they don't find it worth the effort, so be it.
The e-fax provider I use requires Flash. I wrote to them
a while ago pointing out that Flash would soon be EOL'ed.

I followed up a week ago when Adobe placed a warning
on my screen that they were going to KILL Flash in mid Jan.

I'm hoping... that my fax service will have an alternative option.
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
***@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
Carlos E.R.
2020-12-28 19:24:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Those sites will have to change, simple as that. They have been warned
for years.

Another issue is hardware boxes which have an embedded web page that
uses flash, and which can not be updated.

But browsers will stop supporting flash, so it will not work even if you
have it installed.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Peter Flass
2020-12-28 22:52:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by gareth evans
Historic software is usually like the soldier, never
dying but just simply fading away unless and until, that is,
someone versed in computer folklore attempts a resurrection.
Strange, then, the behaviour of Adobe, who are not just
discontinuing the support of their Flash utility, but
actively taking steps to stop it working at all a couple
of weeks into the New Year.
Already I am being prompted to uninstall it from my computers.
This is unfortunate because there are a lot of websites out there
that rely on Adobe Flash; websites that will be unusable shortly.
Particularly for me, the BBC Big Welsh Challenge is something
that I return to again and again in my repeated desultory
attempts to learn the iaith fy nadhau. (The language
of my fathers)
Those sites will have to change, simple as that. They have been warned
for years.
Another issue is hardware boxes which have an embedded web page that
uses flash, and which can not be updated.
But browsers will stop supporting flash, so it will not work even if you
have it installed.
Unless you use an old browser.
--
Pete
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