Discussion:
We don't need no stinkin' computers!
(too old to reply)
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-11 18:36:01 UTC
Permalink
The following can replace your computer!

Accounting forms (I've used them-they're high quality).
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1958-10/page/n1/mode/1up

High grade pencil that cuddles in your hand
https://books.google.com/books?id=L04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA99&dq=life%20ticonderoga&pg=PA99#v=onepage&q&f=false

Smooth writing
https://books.google.com/books?id=X04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA127&dq=life%20ticonderoga&pg=PA127#v=onepage&q&f=false

If you absolutely must use a mechanical device, note
this sophisticated register from NCR. Even calculates
your change!
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1955-05-21/page/n177/mode/1up

Or this nice line of Burroughs adding machines
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1958-07/page/n7/mode/1up

Keep your office nice and warm with bituminous coal heat
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1953-08/page/n24/mode/1up

And then when it's time for break, visit your friendly
neighborhood Howard Johnson's for a treat!
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1955-04-16/page/n102/mode/1up

Take a vacation in the fast record breaking DC-7
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1954-06-19/page/n97/mode/2up
Peter Flass
2020-09-11 19:06:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
The following can replace your computer!
Accounting forms (I've used them-they're high quality).
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1958-10/page/n1/mode/1up
High grade pencil that cuddles in your hand
https://books.google.com/books?id=L04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA99&dq=life%20ticonderoga&pg=PA99#v=onepage&q&f=false
Unfortunately there seem to be a lot of those “inferior pencils” around. I
have some now.
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Smooth writing
https://books.google.com/books?id=X04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA127&dq=life%20ticonderoga&pg=PA127#v=onepage&q&f=false
If you absolutely must use a mechanical device, note
this sophisticated register from NCR. Even calculates
your change!
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1955-05-21/page/n177/mode/1up
Or this nice line of Burroughs adding machines
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1958-07/page/n7/mode/1up
Keep your office nice and warm with bituminous coal heat
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1953-08/page/n24/mode/1up
I thought the headline was referring to Robert Oppeneimer.
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
And then when it's time for break, visit your friendly
neighborhood Howard Johnson's for a treat!
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1955-04-16/page/n102/mode/1up
I miss HoJo. They used to have some on the concessions on the NYS Thruway.
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Take a vacation in the fast record breaking DC-7
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1954-06-19/page/n97/mode/2up
--
Pete
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-11 19:40:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Flass
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
The following can replace your computer!
Accounting forms (I've used them-they're high quality).
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1958-10/page/n1/mode/1up
High grade pencil that cuddles in your hand
https://books.google.com/books?id=L04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA99&dq=life%20ticonderoga&pg=PA99#v=onepage&q&f=false
Unfortunately there seem to be a lot of those “inferior pencils” around. I
have some now.
I use Ticonderoga pencils. They're great and write
smoother and easier than other brands.
Post by Peter Flass
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Keep your office nice and warm with bituminous coal heat
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1953-08/page/n24/mode/1up
I thought the headline was referring to Robert Oppeneimer.
Well, LIFE had him as a cover story:
https://books.google.com/books?id=GVIEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PP1&dq=life%20robert%20oppenheimer&pg=PA120#v=onepage&q&f=false

also
https://books.google.com/books?id=8E0EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA58&dq=life%20robert%20oppenheimer&pg=PA58#v=onepage&q&f=false

and then in 1954 with the scandal
https://books.google.com/books?id=SlMEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA35&dq=life%20robert%20oppenheimer&pg=PA35#v=onepage&q&f=false
Post by Peter Flass
I miss HoJo. They used to have some on the concessions on the NYS Thruway.
They had the rest stops on the Penna and NJ turnpikes.
Years ago they were a good modest family restaurant.

Unfortunately, around 1970 they went downhill. Not
sure why.

My guess is that the old man retained power too long
and let it slide. Several great chains of the era, like
Horn & Hardart in Phila/NYC suffered similar fates.

Many former H/Js in my area became independent diners,
though some were torn down for other uses.

"Indigestion on the turnpike"
https://books.google.com/books?id=ulUEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA12&dq=life%20howard%20johnson&pg=PA12#v=onepage&q&f=false

reservations (split over two pages)
https://books.google.com/books?id=V1QEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA8&dq=life%20howard%20johnson%20reservations&pg=PA8#v=onepage&q&f=false
Mike Spencer
2020-09-11 23:36:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
The following can replace your computer!
High grade pencil that cuddles in your hand
https://books.google.com/books?id=3DL04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=3DPA99&dq=3Dlife%20ticonderoga&pg=3DPA99#v=3Donepage&q&f=3Dfalse
Unfortunately there seem to be a lot of those "inferior pencils"
around. I have some now.
I use Ticonderoga pencils. They're great and write smoother and
easier than other brands.
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Keep your office nice and warm with bituminous coal heat
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1953-08/page/n24/mode/1up
Sitting by a wood-fired stove as I write. Warming it up to bake a
blueberry pie. Advantage of a home office.
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
Joe Pfeiffer
2020-09-12 00:18:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
The following can replace your computer!
High grade pencil that cuddles in your hand
https://books.google.com/books?id=3DL04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=3DPA99&dq=3Dlife%20ticonderoga&pg=3DPA99#v=3Donepage&q&f=3Dfalse
Unfortunately there seem to be a lot of those "inferior pencils"
around. I have some now.
I use Ticonderoga pencils. They're great and write smoother and
easier than other brands.
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
Jorgen Grahn
2020-09-12 08:52:09 UTC
Permalink
...
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Post by Mike Spencer
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
What's right must depend a lot on the paper.

I have a cube of small square papers intended for grocery lists and so
on -- like Post-Its but without the glue. These are however ... not
/glossy/ but very smooth. Almost useless with a HB pencil.

/Jorgen
--
// Jorgen Grahn <grahn@ Oo o. . .
\X/ snipabacken.se> O o .
Dennis Boone
2020-09-12 13:16:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jorgen Grahn
I have a cube of small square papers intended for grocery lists and so
on -- like Post-Its but without the glue. These are however ... not
/glossy/ but very smooth. Almost useless with a HB pencil.
One characteristic of paper is its "tooth". Paying attention to
this is more common for artists than other users.

De
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-16 18:21:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dennis Boone
One characteristic of paper is its "tooth". Paying attention to
this is more common for artists than other users.
Once that and other characteristics were very important (see
other post for sample ads).

Apparently, not so important today.
JimP
2020-09-16 19:00:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Post by Dennis Boone
One characteristic of paper is its "tooth". Paying attention to
this is more common for artists than other users.
Once that and other characteristics were very important (see
other post for sample ads).
Apparently, not so important today.
At my last job before retirement, some departments worried about paper
quality, and tooth, for contract and other related papers. They still
used laser printers though.
--
Jim
Mike Spencer
2020-09-12 20:22:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jorgen Grahn
...
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Post by Mike Spencer
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
Must be regional then. What part of US? I did elementary school in
rural New Hampshire and the rest in urban Massachusetts. Don't think
I ever even saw an HB or xH until near the end of high school or
later.
Post by Jorgen Grahn
What's right must depend a lot on the paper.
My elementary school was very parsimonious with paper. Mostly used
stuff only a couple of steps better than newsprint. A sharp HB or 2H
would tend to rip holes. They had to issue slightly better paper in
the 3rd grade when we were issued dip pens, allowed to have filled ink
wells and taught to write with ink. Yeah, yeah, I'm an old guy.
Remember hectograph?
Post by Jorgen Grahn
I have a cube of small square papers intended for grocery lists and so
on -- like Post-Its but without the glue. These are however ... not
/glossy/ but very smooth. Almost useless with a HB pencil.
Post-Its work fine with a 2B. Can't check an HB as whenever one turns
up by happenstance I throw it away. :-)
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
Charlie Gibbs
2020-09-12 21:10:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
Must be regional then. What part of US? I did elementary school in
rural New Hampshire and the rest in urban Massachusetts. Don't think
I ever even saw an HB or xH until near the end of high school or
later.
Here on the Wet Coast HB is standard, although you can get the others.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | Microsoft is a dictatorship.
\ / <***@kltpzyxm.invalid> | Apple is a cult.
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | Linux is anarchy.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | Pick your poison.
Peter Flass
2020-09-12 21:24:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
Post by Jorgen Grahn
...
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Post by Mike Spencer
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
Must be regional then. What part of US? I did elementary school in
rural New Hampshire and the rest in urban Massachusetts. Don't think
I ever even saw an HB or xH until near the end of high school or
later.
Post by Jorgen Grahn
What's right must depend a lot on the paper.
My elementary school was very parsimonious with paper. Mostly used
stuff only a couple of steps better than newsprint. A sharp HB or 2H
would tend to rip holes. They had to issue slightly better paper in
the 3rd grade when we were issued dip pens, allowed to have filled ink
wells and taught to write with ink. Yeah, yeah, I'm an old guy.
Remember hectograph?
The inkwell and straight pen brings back memories. I think we switched to
fountain pens, but ballpoints weren’t allowed (the ink really smeared).
Post by Mike Spencer
Post by Jorgen Grahn
I have a cube of small square papers intended for grocery lists and so
on -- like Post-Its but without the glue. These are however ... not
/glossy/ but very smooth. Almost useless with a HB pencil.
Post-Its work fine with a 2B. Can't check an HB as whenever one turns
up by happenstance I throw it away. :-)
--
Pete
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-16 18:01:35 UTC
Permalink
On Saturday, September 12, 2020 at 5:24:16 PM UTC-4, Peter Flass wrote:

The inkwell and straight pen brings back memories. I think we switched to
Post by Peter Flass
fountain pens, but ballpoints weren’t allowed (the ink really smeared).
When ballpoint pens were introduced after WW II there was
a lot of prejudice against them. They were forbidden
for use in certain areas.

I think by the early 1960s they were perfected enough so
that even a cheap BIC worked very well, and they make
them today.

Also by that point many people had switched over to the
convenience of ball point. Fountain pens could be messy.

Ironically, today, some commonly used papers, like for
copying machines/printer, aren't well suited for fountain
pen ink. Even certain bank forms don't do well with it.

I don't think bankers worry about check forgery as they
once did.
Joe Pfeiffer
2020-09-12 21:44:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
...
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Post by Mike Spencer
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
Must be regional then. What part of US? I did elementary school in
rural New Hampshire and the rest in urban Massachusetts. Don't think
I ever even saw an HB or xH until near the end of high school or
later.
Seattle suburb.
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-16 18:03:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
My elementary school was very parsimonious with paper. Mostly used
stuff only a couple of steps better than newsprint. A sharp HB or 2H
would tend to rip holes. They had to issue slightly better paper in
the 3rd grade when we were issued dip pens, allowed to have filled ink
wells and taught to write with ink. Yeah, yeah, I'm an old guy.
Remember hectograph?
We used straight newsprint for everyday work, a nicer
grade for tests.

For the computer Teletype, originally we used the standard
yellow paper, but then someone realized for our purposes
newsprint was good enough so they switched. Probably
saved some money given how much we used.
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-16 18:20:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jorgen Grahn
What's right must depend a lot on the paper.
At one time the grade of paper was very important. Companies
devoted full page ads to paper quality for letterheads
and other documents. For instance:

Weston Bond prestige
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1953-08/page/n71/mode/2up?q=paper

Two page Kimberly Clark
https://archive.org/details/Nations-Business-1950-06/page/n51/mode/2up?q=paper


and pens
https://archive.org/details/the-saturday-evening-post-1947-10-25/page/n145/mode/2up

https://books.google.com/books?id=xlUEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA85&dq=life%20waterman%20fountain%20pen&pg=PA85#v=onepage&q&f=false

https://books.google.com/books?id=10QEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA59&dq=hammermill%20printing%20paper&pg=PA59#v=onepage&q&f=false

Side note: Telephone belongs to Main Street
https://books.google.com/books?id=10QEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA59&dq=hammermill%20printing%20paper&pg=PA24#v=onepage&q&f=false
h***@bbs.cpcn.com
2020-09-16 17:58:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
For the US, the standard pencil was the No. 2. I don't
know the equivalence in B gradings.

Some kids with a heavy hand used the No. 3 or 2 1/2.

Of course, the No 2 was the standard for op scanning.

Originally, it was conductive. Here is an interesting IBM writeup on
that:
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/ibm/punchedCard/Training/52-5862-0_The_How_and_Why_of_IBM_Mark_Sensing_Sep49.pdf

Here's a general manual on card design
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/ibm/punchedCard/Training/22-5526-4_The_Design_of_IBM_Cards_Mar56.pdf
Andy Leighton
2020-09-16 19:07:00 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 16 Sep 2020 10:58:18 -0700 (PDT),
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
For the US, the standard pencil was the No. 2. I don't
know the equivalence in B gradings.
Roughly HB.
--
Andy Leighton => ***@azaal.plus.com
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!"
- Douglas Adams
J. Clarke
2020-09-16 22:27:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Post by Joe Pfeiffer
Wow. I grew up (in the US) on 2H.
For the US, the standard pencil was the No. 2. I don't
know the equivalence in B gradings.
Some kids with a heavy hand used the No. 3 or 2 1/2.
A PPOE issued number 3 pencils and crappy paper. If you actually
wanted someone to be able to read what you were writing you put a
carbon under it and gave them the carbon copy.
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
Of course, the No 2 was the standard for op scanning.
Originally, it was conductive. Here is an interesting IBM writeup on
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/ibm/punchedCard/Training/52-5862-0_The_How_and_Why_of_IBM_Mark_Sensing_Sep49.pdf
Here's a general manual on card design
http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/ibm/punchedCard/Training/22-5526-4_The_Design_of_IBM_Cards_Mar56.pdf
Andy Leighton
2020-09-12 13:30:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
The following can replace your computer!
High grade pencil that cuddles in your hand
https://books.google.com/books?id=3DL04EAAAAMBAJ&lpg=3DPA99&dq=3Dlife%20ticonderoga&pg=3DPA99#v=3Donepage&q&f=3Dfalse
Unfortunately there seem to be a lot of those "inferior pencils"
around. I have some now.
I use Ticonderoga pencils. They're great and write smoother and
easier than other brands.
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B.
HB is (or was) the default in the UK too.
--
Andy Leighton => ***@azaal.plus.com
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!"
- Douglas Adams
Charlie Gibbs
2020-09-12 21:04:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Spencer
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
I always liked the classification given in Winnie-the-Pooh:

When Pooh saw what it was, he nearly fell down,
he was so pleased. It was a Special Pencil Case.
There were pencils in it marked "B" for Bear, and
pencils marked "HB" for Helping Bear, and pencils
marked "BB" for Brave Bear.

I guess that makes you a Brave Bear.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | Microsoft is a dictatorship.
\ / <***@kltpzyxm.invalid> | Apple is a cult.
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | Linux is anarchy.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | Pick your poison.
Mike Spencer
2020-09-13 01:07:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Charlie Gibbs
Post by Mike Spencer
I was shocked, as a new-comer to Canada (over 50 years ago), that the
default pencil was HB, not 2B. It was called to my attention when
someone actually sneered at my 2B pencil. I gather children are told
that softer pencils are smeary & untidy. At present, I buy 2B pencils
from Lee Valley under their own marque, "Made in Gt. Britain". All
that could be asked of a good pencil.
When Pooh saw what it was, he nearly fell down,
he was so pleased. It was a Special Pencil Case.
There were pencils in it marked "B" for Bear, and
pencils marked "HB" for Helping Bear, and pencils
marked "BB" for Brave Bear.
I guess that makes you a Brave Bear.
Well said! I occasionally do some sketching so I have some 6B pencils
here somewhere. For a Bear of Very Little Brain, however, that might
offer impenetrable lexical complexity.
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada

Zeitscrift für Bär- Ferkel- und Maultierkunst- und kulturforschung.
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